Kommentare

Kommentar von 17624

Since Holy Light heals for a ton anyway( and tends to overheal a fair amount) and downranking is no longer viable, reducing the cost of Holy Light with this Libram is probably a better option than the relatively small amount of bonus healing granted by Libram of Tolerance .

Kommentar von d3nyd

I'm definitely picking this thing up for my Holy Pally.

Kommentar von annerajb

i quess it depend's on the fight if you are on a hard hitting boss you could use the libram of tolerance but on a fight where you have mana drains and similar stuff you want to use the renewal one.

Kommentar von 5326

Who spams HL enough for this to be useful? Personally I am sticking with my Libram of Mending. As the above poster stated, it gives you 134 mana to use as you please assuming 1HL/30sec.

I cannot think of a single fight in 10 man raiding or heroics where I would spam HL as much as this libram seems to think I would. Even MT healing Patchwerk I only use FoL and Sacred Shield.

Both this and the Libram of Tolerance seem like downgrades to the (70) Libram of Mending.. am I missing something here?

Kommentar von 238018

ummm, seems to me thats why they nerfed illumination in the first place... cuz people found ways to cast a spell for much cheaper than the mana return... if people are getting more mana back than the spell costs, then it will get nerfed again...

the following theorcraft does not take divine illumination into account, as the scope is over 3 gcd's rather than 3 minutes...

but for the sake of argument, lets do a little theorycrafting on this piece, shall we? assuming your raid is taking enough damage to be spamming HL every gcd, let us also make the following assumptions:
- you have 3/3 Light's Grace
- you have 2/2 Infusion of Light
- you holy shock whenever it's up
- you also have enough spell crit to make shocking worth it
- no additional haste outside of talents
- you have 5/5 JotP and keep the buff up

now, at this point; you have 15% static haste, and assuming you keep Light's Grace up- your holy light should cast at 1.74 seconds allowing for gcd's...
-so every 1.74 seconds you are effectively "gaining" 113 mana...
-5/1.74 ~ 2.8 casts, we shall say 3 and round to 5.22 seconds..
- assuming none of those crit, thats 339 mp5 saved over the base cost of 1274*3 = 3822 mana... 339/3822 ~9% mana saved...

so, 9% mana saved with HL spam with no crits and not accounting for infusion of light...

now- assuming all 3 crit and you get 647 mana back (conservative estimate) per crit... thats (339+647*3)/3822 ~60% mana saved...

with infusion of light, it further reduces the cast time of your next holy light by 1 second- so that means you can squeeze an extra cast in there with that 0.7 second holy light cast time, every 6 seconds assuming your 100% crit rating...

so cost of holy shock at 80 is 791 mana...
(339+647*3+791/2)/(3822+791) = 58% mana conserved, but in 0.7 second less time than above...

assuming 1/3 crit chance which is more typical of your holy paladin- the formula changes to:
(339+647)/3822 = 26% mana conservation...

647/3822 = 17% mana conservation without this libram, but still spamming holy light and assuming 1 crit per 3...

with divine illumination and assuming 1 crit per 3, its 52% mana conservation (( (339+647)/(3822/2) )) assuming mana return from illumination is before cost reduction...

so every 3 minutes for 15 seconds you can conserve 42% more mana... whereas this libram gives a static 9% mana conservation (still nothing to scoff at) with holy light spam...

tl;dr version- 9% mana conservation is great and all, but how likely are you to be spamming holy light?

Kommentar von 281449

By far, the best Libram currently for a PvE Holy Pally. It reduces the cost of your Holy Light spell by almost 10%. Remember that Illumination works off of base mana, so you will still get the same amount of mana back from crits.

Kommentar von 58516

However, before you can get the magic combo of gear to make HL spam worthwhile, this is far less useful, especially since raid damage in LK is not high enough to warrant HL spamming for the damage it does to your mana pool.

It is a cheap libram, and easily acquired, but for most cases it's not the best solution, as flash of light suffices in many cases.

Kommentar von 269670

I think one of the problems with aspiring to this libram is the mere fact that... well, how often are you really using Holy Light? If I really have to spam that spell, rather than one every so often when a hard strike hits a bit harder than expected or I healed one or two people without re-applying Beacon of Light, the run is going to be a wipe. Either that or the tank REALLY needs to get better gear. This libram is, I'm sorry to say, a waste of badges. I'll stick w/ my damned Blessed Book of Nagrand (https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=25644) before I detract from the forming of my tanking set. Now the prot book, THAT'S a libram to aim for!

Kommentar von 47121

This is a must-have libram for holy pallies as it is currently an incredibly overpowered libram that, in conjunction with Glyph of Seal of Wisdom, effectively gives you ~500 mp5 on intense fights. Note that these calculations assume you're only casting holy light, and you're mainly spamming it.

The Breakdown:

Holy Light's base cost is 29% of your base mana, which at level 80 is 4,393 * 0.29 = 1,274 mana.

This works with Glyph of Seal of Wisdom independently – they reduce mana independently of one-another (note that I have not tested this personally, but it seems to be the consensus on EJ). This means each holy light costs 1,274 - 113 - (1,274 * 0.05) = 1,097 mana per cast, a difference of 177 mana per cast or 16.13%. Add your 4-piece set bonus, and you've got 1,274 - 113 - 2(1,274 * 0.05) = 1,033.6 mana per cast, a difference of 240.4 mana per cast or 23.26%.

However, the most important part of all of this is the fact that Illumination works off of the base cost of the spell. Meaning that for every crit, you're gaining an effective 764.4 / 1,097 = 69.68% (or 764.4 / 1,033.6 = 73.96% if you've got the 4-piece set bonus) mana per crit rather than the base 60%, assuming you're using both Glyph of Seal of Wisdom and the Libram of Renewal. (Note: this does not mean you're gaining more mana per crit, this means more effective mana per crit: you're able to cast more holy lights, meaning you cast more crits, meaning you get more mana back.)

So, not only are you getting 16.13% reduced mana cost by using the Glyph+Libram together, but you're also increasing your mana return from illumination by 10%.

***MATHS HERE PURELY FOR THE MATHOCISTIC: FEEL FREE TO SKIP OVER THIS PART***
Now, as for it effective mp5, let's assume a pally has 40% crit and 25k mana (both fairly easy to get with 25-man raid gear, even if you're not gearing for crit or int). Taking only the 25k mana pool, it'll take 25,000 / 1,274 = 19.62 casts to go OOM without the Glyph+Libram combo, and 25,000 / 1,097 = 22.79 casts to go OOM with the Glyph+Libram combo.

Now, keep in mind that it's expected that you'll have other forms of mana return: Divine Plea, Replenishment, MP5 and the 600 mana proc from your Insightful Earthsiege Diamond (you are using that, right?) are your biggest sources. Let's say, for the hell of it, that you're spamming Holy Light willy-nilly on a Patchwork offtank and plan on going OOM as soon as the boss drops. Also, let's say your DPS is slow and it takes you 3 minutes and 30 seconds to kill him, you have 100 MP5, you cast Holy Light an average of once per 2 seconds (or 105 times), and you have the chance to cast Divine Plea 3 times. This is the big important formula that shows off the power of the Glyph+Libram combo:

25,000 - + + + + + = 0
25,000 - + + + + + = 0
61,075 - = -335.76C
61,075 = 1,033.6 - 335.76C
61,075 = 697.84C
C = 87.52 casts till OOM and 111,500.48 effective mana.

These are the numbers you'd get without the 4-piece set bonus, but with all other aforementioned considerations:

25,000 - + + + + + = 0
25,000 - + + + + + = 0
61,075 - = -335.76C
61,075 = 1,097C - 335.76C
61,075 = 761.24C
C = 80.23 casts till OOM and 102,213.02 effective mana. The difference in not having the 4-piece set bonus, then, is 111,500.48 - 102,213.02 = 9,287.54, or 9.09%, less effective mana.

Now, let's see what you'd have if you went for a different libram and glyph combo, but kept the 4-piece set bonus:

25,000 - + + + + + = 0
25,000 - + + + + + = 0
61,075 - = -335.76C
61,075 = 1210.3C - 335.76C
61,075 = 874.54C
C = 69.84 Casts till OOM and 88,976.16 effective mana. The difference in having the Glyph+Libram combo, then, is 111,500.48 - 88,976.16 = 22,524.32, or 25.32%, less effective mana.

Without the 4-piece set bonus or the Glyph+Libram, you'd end up with:

25,000 - + + + + + = 0
25,000 - + + + + + = 0
61,075 - = -335.76C
61,075 = 1,274C - 335.76C
61,075 = 938.24C
C = 65.01 casts till OOM and 82,822.74 effective mana. The difference in not having the Glyph+Libram combo or the 4-piece set bonus is 111,500.48 - 82,822.74 = 28,677.74, or 34.63%, less effective mana.

***END OF MATHS***

To summarize:

The Glyph+Libram combo gives you * 100% - 100% = 25.32% more effective mana than you'd have without using that combo. Put in other terms, you're getting * 5 = 536.23 mp5 from that 3 minute and 30 second Patchwork fight.

EDIT: I'd calculated the percent reduction due to the Glyph + Libram combo incorrectly. It is, as is currently stated above, 16.13%, not the previously stated 13.9%.
EDIT2: Added the T7 4-piece bonus maths and recalculated accordingly.

Kommentar von 47121

Heh, the one thing I didn't show the math for, eh?

The reason it's 102k effective mana and not 88k effective mana is because, to show your true effective mana pool, you need to multiply the 80.23 casts with a Glyph+Libram Holy Light (call it G+HHL) by holy light's base cost of 1,274, not it's reduced cost of 1,097.

As you're not actually casting the spell at its base cost, his may seem counterintuitive at first, but let me explain. If you multiply the G+HHL by its reduced cost, you get 88k mana – this is all the mana you'll actually expend through the course of the fight. The same thing holds true for a non-reduced-cost HL: you'll have spent 82k mana, cast over 65 holy lights. The missing part to this logic, though, is the distinction between mana spent and effective mana: effective mana should be considered as potential mana spent added to actual mana spent.

To illustrate: if I have exactly 12,740 mana (without any form or mana regen) and cast a baseline-cost holy light, I'll be able to cast it 10 times. My mana spent will equal my effective mana – they're both 12,740. However, if I burn through the same mana pool, casting only holy lights, but have Divine Illumination active the entire time, then I'll be able to cast HL 20 times while still only spending 12,740 mana. This means my effective mana is my actual mana spent (12,740) added to my potential mana spent (also 12,740) to become 25,480 effective mana. If you multiply the number of casts (20) by the reduced mana cost of each holy light (637), that would merely give you your mana spent (12,740) rather than your effective mana (25,480).

If you multiply the 16.13% reduction you get from the Glyph+Libram by the spent mana pool of a G+HHL spam (88,012.31 * 1.1613), you'll end up with exactly 102,213.02, confirming that answer as the true effective mana.

To be perfectly honest, I started by simply multipyling the amount of casts by the reduced cost to get the effective mana, and if 88k and 82k effective mana weren't as close together as they are, I never would've accounted for potential mana and I would've left it at that. The difference in benefit between a regular HL and a G+HHL would've been a measly 6.27%, not the huge 23.41%. Thankfully, since I was trying to prove a point, I played with the numbers a bit more.

Hope that helps!

Kommentar von saakaf

Still BiS for a Holy Light pally healer. Hurting muh speeeshul gearscore.

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